turbo or supercharge 1fz-fe

phat-truk
Getting to know the place
Posts: 11
Joined: October 25th, 2011, 3:31 pm

turbo or supercharge 1fz-fe

Unread post by phat-truk » December 23rd, 2012, 2:22 pm

in stuck inbetween the 2 and dont know which kit to go, what have you guys done,i dont want a ls1 v8, to much messin around, would love your help guys

Camos
Here and there
Posts: 39
Joined: April 19th, 2010, 6:21 pm

Re: turbo or supercharge 1fz-fe

Unread post by Camos » January 11th, 2013, 9:19 pm

google search or forum search. plenty of info for these options with the 1fzfe! I investigated for months/years and am going down the turbo option! Both end up similar in price so dont use that as a guide line. My opinion was that the 4.5 produces alot of low down grunt (maybe not in nominal figure form, kw/nm)...... but from experience it tends to hang on really well in low rev range, just keeps hanging in there, Hence my turbo choice as it has the grunt before it starts to spool! Others opt the supercharger as in produces power form idle, again that is debatable etc!

monkeybucket
Part of the furniture
Posts: 1949
Joined: April 23rd, 2012, 10:45 am
Location: WA

Re: turbo or supercharge 1fz-fe

Unread post by monkeybucket » January 11th, 2013, 9:21 pm

twin turbo+mandrel exhaust... Braaaaaaap
Cheers
Chris.

Off road when I'm good...in the shed when I'm naughty.

South West All Terrain ... www.swat4x4.com

bornfr3
I'm new, be nice!
Posts: 2
Joined: October 19th, 2018, 11:26 am

Re: turbo or supercharge 1fz-fe

Unread post by bornfr3 » October 19th, 2018, 3:59 pm

There has been a number of discussions about Supercharging or Turbocharging a 1FZ-FE 4.5L Petrol Landcruiser but not enough useful info on the costs vs benefits etc. so far so I have decided to join and give you folks some solid info as I have just Supercharged my 105 Series Petrol 1FZ-FE.

I'd spent several months reading all the forums (Australia and US) and have contacted a number of suppliers for Supercharging and Turbocharging. In the end, it came down to 2. The Sprintex Supercharger supplied by Bulletcars in QLD or the AXT Turbo Kit supplied by AXT Turbo in VIC. I can tell you their costs as follow:

Bullet Supercharger Kit:
$5,450 for the Supercharger alone
$2,195 for the Intercooler Kit (PDW Kit)
$1,250 for the Bullet Performance Exhaust
$980 for a Ceramic Coated Extractors
$1,250 for the Piggyback Tuning Chip (can use XEDE or Unichip) but Bullet recommends XEDE
Installation is $1,200 without the Intercooler or $1,500 with the Intercooler
Cold Plugs are additional $125 and must be fitted. Fitting of Extractors and Exhaust or other modifications are an additional $110/hour
Dyno and Tuning is not done by Bullet and will cost an additional $895
For the complete system listed, the cost is $13,645 as I have paid.

The AXT Turbo Kit:
Turbo Kit alone is $3,650 for the AXT Hybrid T3/T4 Turbo Base Kit
Intercooler (custom water to air) is $2,650
Wolf V550 Computer $2,700
Or Complete Kit with Turbo, Intercooler and Computer is $8,000
Fitting and Tuning is around $2,000 at Goldcoast Performance 4x4 in QLD
AXT Custom Performance Exhaust is $1,250
All up if you fit them all is $11,250.
You can upgrade to a bigger turbo if you wish add an additional cost. Hi flow fuel pump is $550, new injectors $995 etc. These are optional.

The Supercharger has 5-6PSI of boost while the Turbo can be tuned between 5-10 PSI. Above 8PSI you need the Intercooler fitted. Above 10 PSI, engine internal modifications required.

Both kit claims to offer 45-50% Power and Torque increases across the Rev Range. I am not sure how the Turbo can achieve that at low RPM but that was the claim anyways. In terms of servicing, the Turbo is the cheaper option. The Supercharger needs a major service at 40,000km and will reach the end of its life after 80,000km (or needs major overhaul equal to a new one). The turbo will just follows normal vehicle servicing and may only need minor service overtime.


After careful consideration of what I need and also consider reliability issues, I opted for the Supercharger from Bullet. Given my engine has already clocked up 370,000km on the clock, the Supercharger with lower boost is probably the safer option for me. Plus I use my fourby for slow offroad and towing so low down torque and better power is what I am after. The turbo may produce more power at the upper end but will take sometime to spool up and probably harder to control. Also, given sudden boost and it's ferocious nature of the turbo, it would likely kill the engine sooner.

At this point some of you are probably thinking, why the heck did I supercharged a vehicle at this km?

Well, for your info, I've done compression tests on the engine twice and the weakest cylinder reads 185PSI with the rest in the 190-195PSI. The factory spec for this engine as specify by Toyota is 171PSI or more with no less than 128PSI so it's quite impressive for an engine at such high km to return these figures. It doesn't smoke, doesn't consume a drop of oil either. Apart from the compression test, I took the liberty of doing a Leak Down test as well and the leaks were only between 2-6%, which is satisfactory. I even put the vehicle on the Dyno and got 97.5KW and 310NM at the wheels prior to fitting the Supercharger. I was sitting on 33" tyres at the time.

I decided to upgrade the clutch as well to cope with the new power of the Supercharger so an additional $1,500 was spent on a 4-Terrain Ultimate Clutch that can handle up to 800nm of torque.

So what's the results I get and whether I would recommend installing this unit to anyone else?

The straight answer is no.
Looking at the final cost, the issues I encountered and the service I get from Bullet, I would not recommend this path. Mind you, I have no intention of trying to damage anyone's business by writing this review but rather, I want to give you guys the facts based on my experienced with the install. It is a big amount of $$$ to be put into an old 4WD, hence we all need to make an informed decisions rather than just rushing in I think. The installation was pretty quick. Just 3 days which is one reason I picked this kit.

After the installations, I took the car and drove it to CNJ Motorsport in Underwood for Tuning and couldn't wait to feel the 50% gain. Mind you, the 50% gain claimed by Bullet does not require you to upgrade the exhaust or fitting of extractors. I just fitted the lot hoping for even more gains. I also opted for the Unichip as I already had it in the car.

So guys, here are the result you are all waiting for:

Round 1: Put it on Dyno, can't tune it! only got around 3PSI in boost due to air restrictions in the air box and it basically 'choked' the engine anything beyond 3000rpm. I had to take the vehicle home in 'limping mode'. It costs me $645 in tuning. Apart from the air restriction issue, the Radiator fan was hitting the fan's shroud each time I turn. Apparently, my aftermarket Radiator is slightly thicker than the factory (5-10mm) so it's too close to the fan. So back to Bullet.

A small modification fixed the fan issue. The low boost issue however, was not so easy. CNJ Motorsports believed the air restriction lies in the air box as power would jump to 200HP by disconnecting the air box hose. Bullet on the other hand, believed the Safari Snorkel was the culprit as they never had an air box issue for the 100 series cruisers before. They then took the vehicle to ChipTorque on the Goldcoast for a second opinion. Chip torque agreed with Bullet that the Safari Snorkel was the issue so I was told I need a 4" Stainless Steel straight through snorkel. The Safari was 3" at some sections and 2.5" at some and the design has several sharp bends which causes airflow issue I was told.

So a new 4" snorkel was ordered and installed at a cost of $1,440 and on top, I had to replace the Guard at the cost of $600. I was not happy given I plan to spend just $12,000 but it has slowly crept up to $17,000. back and forth with supplier issues and bit and pieces here and there so I got stressed out and couldn't give a hoot about the money more. I just wanted my car back and enjoy it so whatever! I picked up the car again after a week and a half.

Second Round: Off to CNJ Motorsports again. This time, I got told the new Snorkel has reduced the air restriction but still didn't solve the problem. I now got 6PSI of boost to 3200rpm but from there, it started dropping to 5 at close to 4000rpm and just 4PSI and less after that. Max power is at 160HP at the wheels and that's all I can get. Removing the air hose and bypassing the airbox with air filter on, it jumps to 200HP as before. Another $330 in tuning cost and off I go again. At least this time, the car is drivable and not in limp mode and I was just shy of 40HP that I should have got compared to 80HP before.

So what's next?
I was told I now need to upgrade the air box too. I am now even more pissed off but what can I do. Bullet said it's not their Supercharger!
To make matter worse, no company in Australia has an airbox for this car off the shelves so I now have to find someone who can fabricate a custom made airbox to suit the design of the Supercharger. After a few phone calls, I was told I will be up for $1,000-1,200 to supply and fit and I must bring the car to them who is 800km away.

I am just tired and want to leave everything as is for now. Couldn't cope with anymore stress so I stopped here.

So if there is nothing's wrong with the Supercharger, did I get good service from Bullet at least?

I have been told by several sources that the after sales service at Bullet is not so great and I believed it's probably true. Apart from keep having to spend more and more money to fix issues, I found that Bullet has blamed everything on the car but no their product, workmanship or not enough testing. Hence, when things did go wrong, they don't own up to anything. Yes they did help me sort out the issues but would happily charge me the additional labour or time spent and on top of that, they also have no hesitation in charging me a big mark up on the things they order for me even if it costs them nothing more than a phone call to place the order. I am the type who doesn't jump up and down and point fingers just to get freebies but I would expect that they would genuinely help me resolving issues without trying to make more money out of me. I already spent 12K on the kit so they already made some money out of me so I am not sure why they would try to make 30% out of me by just placing the order. It's a bit of a case of take and take rather than give and take.

Good luck with whatever you choose to do. I can tell you guys also. A Drive-In Drive-Out LS2 Conversion is 23K and Killa Kustoms & Kables and 26K for an LS3. Having said so, I don't know whether that costs are for just the engine or would include the exhaust to match. One thing I know for sure is that you do get a new Heavy Duty Clutch with the conversion.

I am now almost up to 20K spending. I wished I have gone the LS2 or LS3 path for not much more. The Supercharger does give a lot more power and torque and makes driving much more pleasurable but I doubt it performs anywhere near an LS2. After spending nearly 20K, I am still stuck with a 370,000 km engine so definitely not worth it. The initial quote was just over 10K for the 50% gain. Realistically, the gain is around 20-25% in power. Even if I put in a new airbox and can tune it to 200HP, that power is near redline which is almost useless. The dyno doesn't give the Torque output figure so I can't comment on the Torque but it does feel a lot more than before.

Hope the info helps you folks make the right decision whether to Supercharge, Turbocharge, LS Conversion or just sell off and buy a Twin Turbo Diesel 200 instead!

bornfr3
I'm new, be nice!
Posts: 2
Joined: October 19th, 2018, 11:26 am

Re: turbo or supercharge 1fz-fe

Unread post by bornfr3 » October 24th, 2018, 4:04 pm

I just want to make a small correction on the service life of the Bullet Supercharger. I think I made a mistake with the service life. I think the major service is at 80,000km rather than 40,000km and the end of life is at 160,000km and not 80,000km. Please double check this info if you intend to fit one or want to make a fair comparison to a turbo. I also find the engine running quite cool with this Supercharger. No heat issue at all, whether this is the result of the heavy duty Adrad Radiator, Ceramic Coated Extractors, King Brown Coated Exhaust System and Intercooler combos that has helped kept the heat down.

Also, I would advise you use the XEDE Chip for this Supercharger if you are planning on installing one. This way, they can't blame the Chip since they recommend it. The XEDE is slightly dearer in price but given it already has a base map, you would probably save money on the tuning.

The other advise is the fitting of the rear facing 4" snorkel. Once the Supercharger is on boost, it feels almost like your right ear drum is being pulled out of your ear if you have your window down. The Supercharger is surprisingly quiet but the sound of air being sucked into the Snorkel is ferocious and deadening. Also, if you have an 80 series, you would need to install the additional MAF Sensor to get the proper tune.

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