Which Fourby - towing !!!

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fmindum
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Which Fourby - towing !!!

Unread post by fmindum » April 22nd, 2012, 10:12 pm

Guys
Not new to the outdoors and off road, just extending the horizons.. Pushing the boundaries. Four years ago did an epic 3 month caravan trip around the right hand half of Australia with wife and 3 kids. Car was a brand new Territory AWD. "Why ? It's not a 4x4," etc, etc.... I hear you. However I lease cars, and the rule where I work is 'Australian made"... So no choice. The Terri had mods I put in myself, being a set of raised King coils, Coilrights in the rear to support the off-road Jayco, roof racks, extra lights, UHF, etc.. To put it bluntly, the Terri was ( and still is) fantastic, we did 17000 kms, half was off the blacktop. We towed the van to places such as Palm Valley in the MacDonnell ranges, from Jabiru to JimJim and Twin Falls, including several a meter deep water crossings, 700 km from Cape Crawford, Hells Gate, Normanton, etc. Even Fraser Island for a week, yep, with the van. As expected, had a few minor challenges, such as a smashed rear screen coming out of kakadu (in the bitumen). It happens. Now, I'm not starting the conversation around -"It's not a 4x4, no low range," etc. The thing towed like a champion and got to places where the only other cars were Cruisers, Patrols and the like.
My problem is this - After leasing it for 3 years, my wife has since taken on the lease through her company and I got myself a "real" 4x4. 2000 GU 4.5 on LPG. Great ! I'm happier throwing the Troll around the tracks given it cost me $17k compared to $56k.... Few scratches here and there, no dramas. The problem I have is the absolute lack of guts from the 4.5 on gas (or petrol) when hitting any sort of incline with the jayco latched on. Van is perhaps 1800kg loaded, plus maybe another extra 400kg in the car when we go out camping with the 3 kids -recovery gear, fridge, etc. etc....
The guys on the Patrol4x4 forum have effectively said - yep - that's a LPG GU for you... Just replaced the converter ($600...) and still getting perhaps 220 kms out of a 90 litre tank of gas, so I'm OVER IT !! If it had guts, then fine - even the Terri averaged 19.4 ltr/ 100km over our 17000 km trip, but we were a total of 4.2 ton !!!! (Jerrys, water, etc. etc.) So the Patrol is going. I'm not about to spend $5k on a turbo charger or $2k on replacing the diff with one from the diesel. Sorry guys - too much hassle. The Patrol is in fantastic nick. 210 on the odometer, and really pristine ! ($18k and it's yours !) Just can't tow !
So talking with various mates I've deduced two things - 1) Diesel is your friend for towing, and 2) I won't pick up a decent diesel Cruiser or Patrol with under 300,000 kms for $18k unless I want to go real OLD!!!... back to the 90's, which I want to avoid.
One bloke I know has run with Jeeps all his life - now his two sons also have cars, also Jeeps. Another mate tows a 22' Jayco Sterling with a WG Jeep Cherokee diesel. Looking through the various online sites, it would appear that I could land a WG Diesel with well under 200k, probably some bits and pieces like a bull bar, extra lights, etc. for between $15 and $18k.... On paper they seem brilliant, and looking around, there are plenty on the road. I can't see many other options other than a lovely Terracan, (Sorry didn't mean to upset anyone bringing the Huyundai into this forum) or the Nissan Terrano, (no thanks) Not keen on the Paj (sits too low - don't like it) and not the Jackeroo - (Could not get comfortable, I'm tall, wife's short, although they seem to be great....) The Prado 90 series I've had before in the 3.4 petrol and liked it, but don't know about the diesel variant, and they are hard to find. The pommy 2.5 Series II Disco has a great write up, but again I don't know enough about them..
So what I'm after is some advice - I guess I'm after the power of the Territory, Economy of a diesel, off-road ability of the Cruiser/Patrol, as low maintenance as I can get - Oil filters, plugs, etc OK, but that's about the extent of it.... I've got a GU to trade in, hopefully for about $16-$18k, and maybe a couple of G's over that...
I've chosen to post this here, on an "Agnostic" site - The Patrol forums say stick with the Nissan, Cruisers say Cruisers, etc.... So really I could not give a fig about the badge. As long as I end up in a truck that will do what I ask, in relative comfort without breaking the bank now (or later) and one that's relatively friendly to work on, parts available, accessories, etc....

Is the Jeep the go ?? Let's hear the pros and cons.... What other options - anyone got a good rig for sale that might fit the bill ??? Thanks Chaps !!!!
'98 FZJ105R. 4.5, Hurricane Extractors, 2.5inch, IronMan 2 inch lift, Coil-Rite bags in rear, Full length Roof Rack, Awning, Roof Tent, Drawers, 80l Fridge, 33inch MTZs, GME UHF, Narva 175s, 12000lb winch on ARB steel bar.

Aussie_Dan
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Re: Which Fourby - towing !!!

Unread post by Aussie_Dan » April 22nd, 2012, 10:37 pm

Are you sure you really don't like the Paj?
With a budget of less then $20K i believe that a NM or NP 3.2 TD Pajero will give you the best driveline package for towing that $20K can buy (without having a squillion km on the clock....). If you haven't driven one, you should, they go extremely well.
Throw a set of airbags inside the rear springs to stop the independent rear end squatting when loaded up, change the top timing chain guide ($20 part) and you will be in business.
I also admire the Jeeps and Land Rovers but I personally believe that the Japs know how to make a good reliable package, no matter what badge is on the front grille.... (there are a few jap 4WD's that are a bit dubious of course but I won't go there....)
Dan.

cmar
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Re: Which Fourby - towing !!!

Unread post by cmar » April 22nd, 2012, 11:41 pm

KIa Sorento diesel. (up to 2010 model) Good fuel economy, tows up to 2.8 tonnes, and should find one in you price range. Off road better than the Territory, and probably similar to the Cherokee.
Haven't owned a 2WD since 1982.

fmindum
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Re: Which Fourby - towing !!!

Unread post by fmindum » April 23rd, 2012, 10:15 am

OK Dan - I've just found a Pajero on line Diesel, manual, bullbar, even a snorkel, 179k on it.. ($17 drive away...) Photos look OK, and just spoke to the dealer. They seem to have decent warranties, so will consider that .Will take a drive this arvo, and who knows, maybe I'll like it. Thanks for the reply mate.
About the Kia, sorry - no chance - just one of those things. With a few mates in the industry, patricularly manufacturing of chassis components, I've really been put off some of these badges. Much lower standards in terms of welds, grade of steel used, etc.... Just can't do it.... Around town, fine, but not towing off-road.... Just a personal thing, and not meant to offend - remember I've put my Territory through hell too, and have had so many tell me it's not a 4x4, etc. so I do feel for the emotive nature of these discussions... Thanks for the rely regardless ! Appreciate the time taken.
'98 FZJ105R. 4.5, Hurricane Extractors, 2.5inch, IronMan 2 inch lift, Coil-Rite bags in rear, Full length Roof Rack, Awning, Roof Tent, Drawers, 80l Fridge, 33inch MTZs, GME UHF, Narva 175s, 12000lb winch on ARB steel bar.

spag1
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Re: Which Fourby - towing !!!

Unread post by spag1 » April 23rd, 2012, 10:47 am

hey mate i know you said you want to stay away from the 90s cars, but seriously i presonally think that an 80 series landcruiser turbo is the way to go

they have oodles of low down torque, especially the factory turbos, good economy, im getting 11L-12L/100 with mine, good offroad ability and maintenance should be the same as your GU

and im not only saying that because i own one, but i dont think a gq will have the power unless it has been modified but if that has happened then normally maintenance is expensive. and a turbo diesel GU as you would know would be out of your price range same as a turbo 100 series which i would have put infront of the 80 as the 1hd donks are great.

fmindum
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Re: Which Fourby - towing !!!

Unread post by fmindum » April 23rd, 2012, 7:09 pm

Hey Aussie Dan - Took the Paj for a spin - nice, but not a turbo, so a bit underwhelming. Amazing turning circle compared to the GU ! Definitely not an option in that one, but glad I took it out - would be interested if I find a Turbo 5 spd diesel, so it's not a definite no. Love the 7 seats given the 2 fold flat, and don't intrude over the wheel arches like the Troll. Otherwise "nice" - not great, not excellent, but nice.... (kinda like the GU..)
Hey Spag1 - I do like to 80 series - Bro-in-law has the petrol LPG and we've been out on the tracks and it does as well as the Troll, but he's perhaps not as courageous as me throwing it around. Hard to find the factory turbo diesel but again they are an option. Had to laugh when the dealer offered me $10k for the Troll... Thanks mate....
Anyway, still no word from any jeep dudes - are the any out there on 4WD Action ??? I saw a whole bunch of Jeeps down around Bunyip state park over Easter, so I know you're out there !!!! What's the go with the WG guys ??? Worth considering ?
'98 FZJ105R. 4.5, Hurricane Extractors, 2.5inch, IronMan 2 inch lift, Coil-Rite bags in rear, Full length Roof Rack, Awning, Roof Tent, Drawers, 80l Fridge, 33inch MTZs, GME UHF, Narva 175s, 12000lb winch on ARB steel bar.

Darknight
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Re: Which Fourby - towing !!!

Unread post by Darknight » April 23rd, 2012, 8:00 pm

Power of the territory proper 4WD etc etc then you go to the people that Ford lifted the Territory motor from Disco 3 however I'm thinking they will be out for your price range. I don't see an 80 doing the 11-12 per 100 unless you are extremely gentile and unloaded and loaded they drink lots.

Aussie_Dan
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Re: Which Fourby - towing !!!

Unread post by Aussie_Dan » April 23rd, 2012, 10:20 pm

fmindum wrote:Hey Aussie Dan - Took the Paj for a spin - nice, but not a turbo, so a bit underwhelming. Amazing turning circle compared to the GU ! Definitely not an option in that one, but glad I took it out - would be interested if I find a Turbo 5 spd diesel, so it's not a definite no. Love the 7 seats given the 2 fold flat, and don't intrude over the wheel arches like the Troll. Otherwise "nice" - not great, not excellent, but nice.... (kinda like the GU..)
What model and year was the Paj?
As far as I was aware all Pajero diesel's have been turbocharged since at least the year 2000.
If it was a 3.2 and you came out 'underwhelmed' performance wise, there was something seriously wrong with that particular vehicle!
You have said that the rear seats folded flat so it must have been a NM or later. Do you have an internet link to the vehicle you drove?
I've get the feeling you may have driven an NM with the older 2.8 turbo under the bonnet.... The 3.2 is in a completely different league!
The 3.2 came out in 2002.
Let us know.....
Cheers, Dan.

garrycol
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Re: Which Fourby - towing !!!

Unread post by garrycol » April 23rd, 2012, 11:31 pm

The obvious choice to suit your need would be a Discovery 2a with the TD5 diesel - will run rings around a Pajero and most other wagons.

Disco_S.two
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Re: Which Fourby - towing !!!

Unread post by Disco_S.two » April 24th, 2012, 9:22 am

Yup, what garrycol said.

For LOTS of info check out http://www.aulro.com/.

Waz

Aussie_Dan
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Re: Which Fourby - towing !!!

Unread post by Aussie_Dan » April 24th, 2012, 9:32 am

garrycol wrote:The obvious choice to suit your need would be a Discovery 2a with the TD5 diesel - will run rings around a Pajero and most other wagons.
Sorry Garrycol, but I'm certain that as a tow truck a DiD Paj will obliterate a TD5 disco. 121Kw & 373Nm vs 101Kw & 315Nm. And if you want an Auto, you will get a 5 speed in the Mitsi which will only help more.
A D3 with the V6TD under the bonnet would be a different story of course.
Dan.

Disco_S.two
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Re: Which Fourby - towing !!!

Unread post by Disco_S.two » April 24th, 2012, 11:11 am

Aussie_Dan wrote:
garrycol wrote:The obvious choice to suit your need would be a Discovery 2a with the TD5 diesel - will run rings around a Pajero and most other wagons.
Sorry Garrycol, but I'm certain that as a tow truck a DiD Paj will obliterate a TD5 disco. 121Kw & 373Nm vs 101Kw & 315Nm. And if you want an Auto, you will get a 5 speed in the Mitsi which will only help more.
A D3 with the V6TD under the bonnet would be a different story of course.
Dan.
Unless he wants to tow something larger than 2500kgs.

My Td5 is 125kW and 380Nm without any physical mods.

Just sayin.

Waz

fmindum
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Re: Which Fourby - towing !!!

Unread post by fmindum » April 24th, 2012, 11:14 am

Hey Dan - it was definitely a 2.8, think NL ??? Fairly sure not a Turbo - as I would have seen something under the lid saying Turbo...??? no wizzing either when accelerating.. it was on the Knox Mitsubishi site, $16990 - still there.
Garry - I've been a fan of the "look" of the disco, and read good write-ups, in particular one regarding the 2.5 TD5 vs the 3.0 TD Prado - Disco won hands down according to the article. Still wary though of the pommy aspect, electrics, etc... Looking at the hassels I'm having with a straight forward GU, I'm loathed to take it to the next level....
Where do you get an honest 4bi from ????
'98 FZJ105R. 4.5, Hurricane Extractors, 2.5inch, IronMan 2 inch lift, Coil-Rite bags in rear, Full length Roof Rack, Awning, Roof Tent, Drawers, 80l Fridge, 33inch MTZs, GME UHF, Narva 175s, 12000lb winch on ARB steel bar.

Aussie_Dan
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Re: Which Fourby - towing !!!

Unread post by Aussie_Dan » April 24th, 2012, 11:29 am

Seriously, go find yourself a 3.2 to drive... There's plenty on carsales for under 20K. Will have around 200K on the clock though.
Cheers, Dan.

Aussie_Dan
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Re: Which Fourby - towing !!!

Unread post by Aussie_Dan » April 24th, 2012, 11:30 am

Disco_S.two wrote:
Unless he wants to tow something larger than 2500kgs.

My Td5 is 125kW and 380Nm without any physical mods.

Just sayin.

Waz
That does sound Better Waz and would definately go well with that amount of torque.... Did Landrover up the output of the TD5 in later years compared to when they were first released?
Dan.

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