landcruiser 80 series (HDFT) rattling noise on acceleration

Dannyb
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landcruiser 80 series (HDFT) rattling noise on acceleration

Unread post by Dannyb » March 20th, 2016, 2:31 pm

Hi guys,

I have recently bough a 1997 GXL HDJ80. I have taken it on a few trips and she runs really well only on the last trip a noticed a rattling sound while accelerating. It sort of disappears at higher speeds (possible due to road noise) and when taking the foot of the accelerator. Car has got 351,000 ks on it.

All I can find on the internet seems to related to petrol engines with knock. Being a diesel (1hd-ft) this should not be possible right? Except if the timing is out.....

So I checked the timing belt and it seems like there is not much tension on it, but I am not sure how much tension should be on this. I also have a HZJ75 (with a spring tensioner) and that timing belt has heaps more tension.

Should the hydraulic tensioner provide the same amount of tension as the spring tensioner (I would think so) and could the rattling sound be caused by some slack in the timing belt (i.e. I can move it slightly up and down before feeling tension on the belt.....)

Thanks

Peter Aawen
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Re: landcruiser 80 series (HDFT) rattling noise on accelerat

Unread post by Peter Aawen » March 20th, 2016, 5:09 pm

Did you check the oil level as soon as this noise started happening??

Way back when I helped run a fleet of Toyota's, we always made sure that the oil was checked regularly each day of use & despite that we still had a few of the TD 80's 'suddenly' use a lot of oil when they were worked hard. So when I started running Tag-along Tours, we were always careful to keep an especially close eye on them. From our experience, and we've had quite a few 80 Series L/c's with these motors come on trips with us over the years, they seem to be great in the main, but almost all of them seem to 'suddenly' go thru a lot of oil whenever the motor was run hot &/or worked hard - and that often happens on 4WD trips! Despite our practice of reminding everyone every morning that they should check their oil each & every day we were out, I'm not sure that this always happened, & often the first the TD 80 owners knew about their oil being low was when the motor started 'rattling' or clattering on acceleration..... :o If we caught up with it making noises like that soon enough, generally all it took to resolve the problem & get rid of the noise was to top up the oil at the first sign, & then make sure they checked the oil regularly whenever the vehicle was worked hard.

These motors seem to be fine on oil use for daily/weekly running, but if you go on a trip & do more than a couple of hours straight of high speed running, check the oil!! If you do a fair bit of low range work, check the oil!! If you go on an extended 4WD trip, check the oil every morning before starting up. And if the vehicle ever starts rattling or clattering on acceleration or under load, stop then & there, let it sit for 10 mins or so for all the oil to return to the sump, and then check AND top up the oil if necessary!!

For the few who ignored this call to check the oil regularly & particularly to check & top up whenever the motor started making noises under load/accel (& sadly, there were a few who knew better than to just err on the side of caution) who continued to push on without checking, often because they just knew that their motor never used oil between oil changes when they were running around town or just up & down the freeway for an hour of so at a time, the results were invariably quite expensive!! :( ie Full motor strip down & re-build type expensive!! :eek:

I don't know if it's a feature of the oil type recommended for these motors & it becoming 'thinner' when hot; if it's collecting significant quantities of contaminants during light running that then burn off when worked harder; or if it is something about the way everything inside the motor heats up & might burn more oil when they work hard; all I really know is that over the years those who've heard these noises almost always find the oil level has fairly quickly & usually unexpectedly fallen, often dangerously low! If they check & top up their oil when the noises first start, it's rarely much more of an issue than that; but the people who've poo-poohed the concept & didn't/wouldn't bother checking & topping their oil up as necessary after working the motor harder than normal often ended up on the side of the road with a dead motor not too long afterwards. :(

So, while I'm not saying this is definitely your problem, in my experience with 80 series turbo diesels, I'd be checking the oil level as soon as you started hearing clattering or rattling noises from the motor after it's been working harder than your usual daily driving. With any luck, it's just noisier due to a low oil level... If not... :o

Good Luck
An Ex-Service person is someone who thought enough about their country & how great it is, how lucky we are to live here, to write a blank cheque made out to 'The People and Commonwealth of Australia' for the value of 'Up to & including my Life!'

Dannyb
Here and there
Posts: 79
Joined: May 8th, 2011, 3:11 pm

Re: landcruiser 80 series (HDFT) rattling noise on accelerat

Unread post by Dannyb » March 20th, 2016, 7:53 pm

Thanks for your reply Pete, but sadly no. I always check my oil level when I depart the next morning and it has not used any oil. I know under the bonnet it recommends a very light oil but I run 15W-40 in my HD-FT.

I hope it is the timing belt tensioner as it is an easy fix, but I am trying to understand how this can generate such a noise... The fuel injection timing should still be correct in relation to the cylinder location as the fuel pump is gear driven...

Dannyb
Here and there
Posts: 79
Joined: May 8th, 2011, 3:11 pm

Re: landcruiser 80 series (HDFT) rattling noise on accelerat

Unread post by Dannyb » January 3rd, 2017, 3:46 pm

Peter,

Could the rattling noise be caused by an injector? I have still got the noise after driving almost 10,000 ks with it and hasn't really changed, but I am still worried plus it annoys me. I have notice that when I run diesel additive (I run flash lube most of the times) it seems to quieten down a bit. But if I run out of additive it becomes a bit more pronounced the noise. Could this mean it is an injector or the fuel pump?

Especially since the noise only seems to be produced on acceleration with load on the engine. I.e. I cannot reproduce it by just revving it standing still. And when taking the foot off the accelerator it also becomes less pronounced (although still noticeable). It is only there from about 2000 - 2500 rpm in 3rd 4th and 5th gear (when there is more load on the engine). Or could this be a boost/ exhaust leak?

Peter Aawen
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Re: landcruiser 80 series (HDFT) rattling noise on accelerat

Unread post by Peter Aawen » January 3rd, 2017, 7:03 pm

Hi Danny, yeah, there are a lot of things it could be, an injector or the inj pump &/or timing amongst them... but identifying exactly which one it actually is could be somewhat more problematical! :whyme:

Failed or failing Injector or Injection noises are generally more of a knock or regular thump than a rattle, and the noises a worn injector pump or poor timing might make are generally most obvious at idle/no load conditions; so neither of those two fits exactly with the 'rattling noises on accel only' description - but the 'going away with diesel additive' could be common in both cases! :o

Could it be a boost/exhaust leak? Sure it could, altho you'd think by the 10k mark you'd be able to see a clearly defined black 'spray' of exhaust gasses marking something where they leaked out - have you had a thorough search?? While you are looking on the exhaust side of things for that tell-tale black mark left by leaking diesel fumes, don't neglect the high pressure intake air side!! Pressurised charge air leaking out of the intake side of things might also make a noise that could fit your description. :urgh:

Buut, if you can't see an obvious leak point or other potential noise source, you might be best off to try using a mechanic's stethoscope or a long handled screw driver - put the probe or pointy end of the screw driver to the potential noise source, & with the earpieces of the stethoscope in your ears or the handle end of the screw driver touching the bone behind your ear, the noise source should identify with a clearly louder sound than anywhere else. However, I think this one really sounds like it's gonna be one of those 'search every possible source for it anywhere &/or everywhere' things or a 'just put up with it 'til something breaks' thing!!
An Ex-Service person is someone who thought enough about their country & how great it is, how lucky we are to live here, to write a blank cheque made out to 'The People and Commonwealth of Australia' for the value of 'Up to & including my Life!'

Dannyb
Here and there
Posts: 79
Joined: May 8th, 2011, 3:11 pm

Re: landcruiser 80 series (HDFT) rattling noise on accelerat

Unread post by Dannyb » January 5th, 2017, 7:02 pm

Thanks Peter. It was suggested on another forum that it might actually be the timing of the fuel pump... Apparently there is a cold start advance timing on the 1HD -FT diesel pump and if it is stuck it could be detonating before it reaches TDC...

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