Basic welding skills - anyone got pointers or know courses?

What's protecting your 4WD, and how do you melt it together?
shamrock4life01
Here and there
Posts: 58
Joined: June 4th, 2012, 12:11 pm

Basic welding skills - anyone got pointers or know courses?

Unread post by shamrock4life01 » February 15th, 2013, 9:15 pm

Me and a few of my mates have been bitten hard by the 4wd bug recently. we are all apprentices so the $$ are not exactly free flowing. we have been looking into knocking up some of our own barwork. we need an entry lever mig welder and the basic skills required to use one. looked into tafe but they only run trade courses. anyone have any pointers? or know of any starter mig welding courses in NSW?

cheers
"if u cant find it, GRIND IT"
1985 landcruiser bundera. 1kz-te engine in her. work in progress =)

oversite
Need to get out more
Posts: 2499
Joined: January 30th, 2012, 3:41 pm
Location: Armidale, NSW

Re: Basic welding skills - anyone got pointers or know cours

Unread post by oversite » February 15th, 2013, 10:21 pm

Hi Mate,

Good on you guys, many people are going to say that you need to spend lots of $$ to get into welding but thats just not true. The $300 gas/gassless MIG from bunnings (or anywhere) is a fine machine to learn on and to use for barwork.

the best way to learn is to find someone that can weld well. and get them to show you the basics. The internet is a great source for advice.

Any specific problems feel free to msg.

ROCKET0764
Here and there
Posts: 41
Joined: December 12th, 2012, 3:31 pm
Location: PERTH, WA

Re: Basic welding skills - anyone got pointers or know cours

Unread post by ROCKET0764 » February 15th, 2013, 11:08 pm

shamrock4life01 wrote:Me and a few of my mates have been bitten hard by the 4wd bug recently. we are all apprentices so the $$ are not exactly free flowing. we have been looking into knocking up some of our own barwork. we need an entry lever mig welder and the basic skills required to use one. looked into tafe but they only run trade courses. anyone have any pointers? or know of any starter mig welding courses in NSW?

cheers
Oversite is spot on, go and buy a cheapie ( divvie it up between the boys ) grab some offcuts and go for it! best way to learn is with the basics and proceed form there and make the mistakes! Then go again, thats how i started 30 yrs ago and now run my own company :thumb:
Feel free to pm me if u need a tip or 2!
Cheers.
RETIRING, SOON!

dhc4ever
Part of the furniture
Posts: 1216
Joined: March 24th, 2007, 11:39 am
Location: Ipswich Qld

Re: Basic welding skills - anyone got pointers or know cours

Unread post by dhc4ever » February 16th, 2013, 7:07 am

This is where it starts................
The web has a lot of good info and some utter crap as well.
This blokes site is a good one; http://www.weldingtipsandtricks.com/
There is also some good some and not so good on youtube.
Safety first, cover up, wear shoes long sleeves and gloves. A auto darkening helmet is very useful and they arent all that expensive these days, saftey glass or a face shield are a MUST for grinding, get some P2 or P3 breathing masks, gasless mig produces a LOT of fumes you dont want to be breathing.
Dont weld near flammable liquids.
Other stuff to get, a 4 to 5 inch grinder, grinding discs, cutting discs, flapper discs and maybe a wire type brush for it, hand wire brush, a few clamps and magnets ( troll through supercheaps welding section)
Start by cleaning the area of you want to weld back to clean bright metal with the grinder, do the point you connect the earth lead to as well.
With gasless mig pull the hand piece start at the left end and go right, with gas you generally go the other way.
Set the machine up so it produces a frying bacon type sound at the arc. Keep the hand piece at a consistent distance from the job as you weld, a small side to side weave can be beneficial.
Use steel more than 3mm to practice on, its harder to blow holes through it.
Go to it, be safe.

Bala
Avid Poster
Posts: 751
Joined: August 12th, 2009, 12:23 pm

Re: Basic welding skills - anyone got pointers or know cours

Unread post by Bala » February 16th, 2013, 8:14 am

My No1 tip to those learning to, or having trouble welding,

Make sure you lenses are in good condition and clean,

You need to be able to clearly to see what is happening,

if you cant see properly you cant weld properly.

oversite
Need to get out more
Posts: 2499
Joined: January 30th, 2012, 3:41 pm
Location: Armidale, NSW

Re: Basic welding skills - anyone got pointers or know cours

Unread post by oversite » February 16th, 2013, 1:46 pm

I agree with everything that has been said (auto-darkening welding helmets are amazing) except for one thing.

If you practice on thin steel 1.6mm-2mm you will be a better welder in the long run. if you blow holes in things at the beginning you will learn how to fill them and avoid doing it (more important with stick but still applies to MIG). If you learn with 3mm> you will have trouble later on when using thinner steel.

:)

bowman
Here and there
Posts: 39
Joined: October 25th, 2008, 4:53 pm
Location: Rutherford, NSW

Re: Basic welding skills - anyone got pointers or know cours

Unread post by bowman » March 4th, 2013, 4:23 pm

One thing I will say is clean where you are going to weld. Gal is hard to weld over for the beginer and can make you sick with the fumes. If you are going to use fluxcore or gassless wire, which is good for outside, crank it up as it needs higher amps to work. Keep the tip about 3-5mm off the job.
Just get into it and have a go and learn.
Ron

shamrock4life01
Here and there
Posts: 58
Joined: June 4th, 2012, 12:11 pm

Re: Basic welding skills - anyone got pointers or know cours

Unread post by shamrock4life01 » March 5th, 2013, 8:34 pm

thanks for all the responses guys, all useful information. been playing with an old arc welder "borrowed" from my pop this week. getting some good results =)
"if u cant find it, GRIND IT"
1985 landcruiser bundera. 1kz-te engine in her. work in progress =)

mickkk
Here and there
Posts: 73
Joined: April 16th, 2010, 8:13 pm

Re: Basic welding skills - anyone got pointers or know cours

Unread post by mickkk » March 8th, 2013, 10:42 pm

I got a welding question which I will tack on here (get it)

I am also wanting to learn to weld, but my question is more about welders.

What welder would you get if you were just starting out.
I have a few requirements tho,

Single phase
Ideally something to weld alloy too
Some what portable
Be able to weld gas-less (may help the portability)

Money is not real issue, I would happily pay $10k for a welder that would make me a pro welder, just point and shoot :twisted: But they still have not made one yet haha. And I also dont want to buy something that I will be wanting to upgrade in a few years. In saying that I still want value for money, and it will not be seeing a huge work load.

oversite
Need to get out more
Posts: 2499
Joined: January 30th, 2012, 3:41 pm
Location: Armidale, NSW

Re: Basic welding skills - anyone got pointers or know cours

Unread post by oversite » March 9th, 2013, 12:19 am

Hi Mate,

If you want to learn I would start with a cheap machine Go a no-name MIG that is gas/gassless and then if you like it/ are getting more professional you can go for somehting more professional spec.

The ozito (i know no-name), $350 gas/gasless mig from bunnings is suprisingly good and if you are keen to weld spend some $$ on an auto darkening helmet. It and its comparable competitors are portable, single phase, can run gas or without and if you get good you could possibly even weld alloy in the long run!

mickkk
Here and there
Posts: 73
Joined: April 16th, 2010, 8:13 pm

Re: Basic welding skills - anyone got pointers or know cours

Unread post by mickkk » March 9th, 2013, 8:37 am

Is there any difference between cheap welders and good welders in relation to ease to use. Main reason I ask as I was playing with a cheap stick welder that is about 15 years old, on thin steel. Had no luck at all. Got a mate welder to show me what I was doing wrong and he blamed the welder, he was struggling with it too and said it was not a good welder to learn on, and said to get a mig. It also cut out after about 30 mins. I didn't mention I would want to do thick steel down to sheet, don't know if that makes a difference.

bowman
Here and there
Posts: 39
Joined: October 25th, 2008, 4:53 pm
Location: Rutherford, NSW

Re: Basic welding skills - anyone got pointers or know cours

Unread post by bowman » March 9th, 2013, 9:18 am

Sometimes the cheepies don't fine enough settings to do thin or thick metal. I got a 120amp gass/gassless from Gassweld for about $600 I have done ally welding and some stainless with it, Welded steel from tin can to 6mm as tests with good results. If that is any help.
Ron

DJR96
Need to get out more
Posts: 3153
Joined: May 25th, 2007, 10:54 pm
Location: Beerwah, QLD

Re: Basic welding skills - anyone got pointers or know cours

Unread post by DJR96 » March 9th, 2013, 10:16 am

A "good" welder (as opposed to a "cheapie") will have a decent duty cycle. Meaning it won't thermally overload and cut-out all the time. Get stuck into a decent job and it sucks having to wait for the welder to cool down all the time.
It'll also have a decent reliable wire feed unit and hand-piece. Readily available parts.
Any MIG welder can run gasless wire. So it's not exactly a selling point.... Go with gas if you've got the work for it. Cheaper in the long run and less toxic fumes for you.

I'm of the opinion that you're better off getting a good used machine than a mediocre new machine. Quite frankly I wouldn't touch anything under 150amps.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/LINCOLN-MIG- ... 41713bb050

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/MIG-WELDER-K ... 257b7ed913

And pretty much the Rolls Royce of MIG's...
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Kempact-3000 ... 1c30c0e249
(At opening bid price it's a bargain too!)
Cheers, Dave.
RCV Supertourer build:- [url]http://www.4wdaction.com.au/forum/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=36370[/url]

DJR96
Need to get out more
Posts: 3153
Joined: May 25th, 2007, 10:54 pm
Location: Beerwah, QLD

Re: Basic welding skills - anyone got pointers or know cours

Unread post by DJR96 » March 9th, 2013, 10:21 am

As for learning, yes the above tips are all good.
I'd suggest learning on 3mm+ material, because what you need to be learning early on is what's going on in the actual arc, the weld pool and getting it to melt into the parent metal nice and evenly to both sides. That goes for any type of welding too. Get that fundamental right and then you can scale it down to thinner material. But it's not so easy to get that action happening on thin stuff without frustration.......
Cheers, Dave.
RCV Supertourer build:- [url]http://www.4wdaction.com.au/forum/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=36370[/url]

whizzo
Need to get out more
Posts: 4852
Joined: November 22nd, 2009, 10:43 am

Re: Basic welding skills - anyone got pointers or know cours

Unread post by whizzo » March 9th, 2013, 11:06 am

A couple of serious safety concerns.

MIG welders chuck out heaps of UV....when we say cover up we are serious....I got a UV burn on my leg where my trousers rode up and my socks did not cover......over 2 years later, it still shows at times.
I know blokes who have had UV burns from holes in their shirts.....one mate of mine who does a lot of welding got burned thru a shirt ( like a mild sunburn) that had become a little thin & you could see the outlines of his pockets in his chest.

So do not underestimate the intensity of the UV that can come from MIG and TIG.....gloves always, good heavy, long sleves, long trousers, work wear....leather gear if you have it.

DO not use any of the spray solvents especially brake clean prior to or arround welding..the UV reacts with the solvents and produces very toxic gasses.

But on a cheerry note MIG is a great thing.

The #1 postitive tip is...clean material......use a flap disk or grinder to make sure the faces to be joined are clean bright steel and for some distance either side of the weld.....everything will work better.

Haynes, publish a "welding manual" that might be helpful.

If you go across to http://www.woodworkforums.com.au ......yes I know......but look for their "metalwork" section ( in the page header), go to the "welding" section...there is heaps of stuff there.....search on "Graham Collins"....he is a crusty old trade instructor.....he has posted some fabulous tutorial threads on welding.

cheers

Return to “Barwork and Metal Fab”