What could be causing Front road noise?

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pedropajero96
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Location: Mandurah, WA

What could be causing Front road noise?

Unread post by pedropajero96 » December 1st, 2016, 3:45 pm

I have recently changed from Cooper AT3s to ST Maxx.
I now have a 'road noise' when braking when I get down to about 20kph, and when turning corners at about the same speed, eg. Going round a roundabout. This is also present with either left or right lock. However it wasnt there as soon as they were changed over.
If you can imagine dry, over-tightened wheel bearing ..... that's about my best description of the noise ..... similar to chunky tyre road noise ...... but the thing is, it is only really noticeable under these conditions.
I have had it looked at by two 'professionals' and they reckon tyre noise. I have had Coopers state rep ride with me and give the tyres a good look over, but he's not convinced it is the tyres. There appears to be more wear on the inner blocks than others.
I have had them all rebalanced and another wheel alignment done
I have had all steering, bearings and suspension checked
I have aftermarket grooved discs, and have had for a long time ...... someone suggested it may be these ...?
I am wondering if it is anything to do with the axles/diff
Anyone have any suggestions?
Cheers,
Malcolm
2011 Single Cab Chassis
ARB Bull Bar, Avenger Winch, XRay HIDs,265/70/16 Cooper AT3s,ARB OME HD springs/shockies all round with nominal 2" lift,LR fuel tank, additional 80lt tank under tray,Max Trax,GME UHF Radio,Mobile Booster ariel,GPS and Laptop runni

mydmax
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Re: Front road noise?

Unread post by mydmax » December 1st, 2016, 7:03 pm

The deafness of the Cooper Rep is worrying.

Even with a topnotch hearing aid he probably still won't hear it.

Peter Aawen
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Re: What could be causing Front road noise?

Unread post by Peter Aawen » December 2nd, 2016, 11:14 am

I doubt it'd be the slotted discs after all this time, unless the pads are wearing down?!? If there 'appears' to be more wear on the inner tread blocks, maybe it is tyre noise due to wear?!? What settings did you get with the wheel alignments?? That could be at least part of the problem, too much toe in &/or camber could mean the tyres will progressively howl more as they wear...

Maybe you could try swapping the rear tyres onto the front & across to the other side so that they run in the other direction for a bit & see if that makes any change?!
An Ex-Service person is someone who thought enough about their country & how great it is, how lucky we are to live here, to write a blank cheque made out to 'The People and Commonwealth of Australia' for the value of 'Up to & including my Life!'

pedropajero96
Here and there
Posts: 54
Joined: February 20th, 2011, 1:38 pm
Location: Mandurah, WA

Re: What could be causing Front road noise?

Unread post by pedropajero96 » December 5th, 2016, 6:26 pm

I have rotated the tyres in all ways possible, but it hasnt made any difference.
I didnt get any output from the wheel alignment ...... i was told their printer wasnt working. I was told it is OK. It was only done about 10k km before, shortly after i put the new rubber on ... again with no adjustment being required.
Theres no pull or shaking through the steering either, so im confident alignment is OK.
I will try to see if i can change the front wheels/tyres with some normal road tyres and see if that makes any difference
2011 Single Cab Chassis
ARB Bull Bar, Avenger Winch, XRay HIDs,265/70/16 Cooper AT3s,ARB OME HD springs/shockies all round with nominal 2" lift,LR fuel tank, additional 80lt tank under tray,Max Trax,GME UHF Radio,Mobile Booster ariel,GPS and Laptop runni

Peter Aawen
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Posts: 20807
Joined: June 17th, 2005, 8:01 pm

Re: What could be causing Front road noise?

Unread post by Peter Aawen » December 5th, 2016, 9:14 pm

'Pull & shaking' doesn't necessarily vary all that much with wheel alignment that's 'close to but clearly not right for the vehicle'.... You can have absolutely none of either pull &/or shaking but still have alignment that's 'flog the tyres out in just 1000km' wrong, altho admittedly it'd probably drive at least a little 'nervously' on the road!! But then some people like the 'direct steering' that can come with the sort of miss-alignment that can flog tyre treads & make them howl with road noise....

You mentioned earlier that the tyres seem to be wearing more on the inside - if you can get an accurate measurement of tread depth that does show that your tyres are wearing more/faster on the inside edges, then you almost certainly do have a wheel alignment issue & that issue may well be contributing significantly to any road noise. Another way of checking for that sort of alignment issue is to get a reading of the tread temperatures at about 5 evenly spaced points in a straight line across the tread face of each tyre within about 30 secs to 1 min of driving hard with some cornering included - higher temp strips of tread blocks along the inside edge of the tyre suggests strongly that you may have a wheel alignment issue, while noticeably hotter or cooler temp strips in the middle or edges suggests you may have a tyre pressure issue, or at least aggressive braking &/or steering are having an adverse effect on your tyre wear.... :boggle:

Buuut, it does sorta sound like wheel alignment is not really the only cause of your issue - so have you tried varying your tyre pressures?? What do you run normally on the road atm? How hard are you pushing your vehicle while it's making this noise? Any heavy braking or aggressive steering involved?? Varying your tyre pressures up or down by at least 25 percent (without exceeding the max pressure for the tyre printed on the sidewall of course!) & then driving (very carefully) along the same road & around the same corners etc at the sam sort of speeds should produce some change in the noise; but unless it's a significant change, it probably won't be that creating the issue either & you are once more back with this being a tyre noise issue, or at least a tyre noise on that road surface at those speeds issue!! You haven't found the noise different on any other road surfaces have you??

Can't offer much else - if you check & then discount all the other possibilities, then the only thing left for it to be is road noise & while you might be able take that to the tyre manufacturer... to do so you will need to carefully check & fully document the wheel alignment specs, tyre pressure variations, & even speed & road surface variations & everything else you've tried & varied & then discounted in order to get any redress from the tyre manufacturer. Or you could just learn to put up with it until you can't anymore & then you swap out the tyres!! :o
An Ex-Service person is someone who thought enough about their country & how great it is, how lucky we are to live here, to write a blank cheque made out to 'The People and Commonwealth of Australia' for the value of 'Up to & including my Life!'

mydmax
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Joined: August 4th, 2011, 10:43 pm

Re: What could be causing Front road noise?

Unread post by mydmax » December 6th, 2016, 11:13 am

If the tyres are wearing on the inside ribs then there is either a dynamic Toe OUT condition happening when being driven AND / OR there is a negative camber issue.

That will be more noticed on roundabouts with tread block noise intensity.

The alignment may be perfect when stationary on a test rig with no dynamic forces present, but not good on the road, or whoever is adjusting/aligning it isn't getting it right.

If you have a toe in OR toe out situation you will never know when driving because the forces created are equal. Unequal Camber may cause pulling to one side as does unequal caster.

The idea of shaking and vibration is hardly ever a wheel alignment issue and always something else.
Unfortunately, Aussies have been conditioned to think vibes and shaking are wheel alignment issues and they are not. When there is shaking and vibes it is caused by a physics being not correct. ie out of balance worn parts etc.

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