Oils & Oil Additives, what's good, what works?

Discuss technical aspects of your 4WD with other owners, and share your opinions
superg
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Oils & Oil Additives, what's good, what works?

Unread post by superg » October 9th, 2005, 10:30 pm

Hi Guys, im wondering what a good oil additive is to stop oil consumption. I know im losing the oil through one of the piston rings because when the head was off i could see a film of oil in one of the cylinders. I was just wondering what is the best choice out there? thanks.

Peter Aawen
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Re:Oil Additives

Unread post by Peter Aawen » October 10th, 2005, 11:52 am

BP Corse Plus, change oil brands to this to minimise oil usage (unless it's really stuffed!)

superg
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Re:Oil Additives

Unread post by superg » October 10th, 2005, 12:25 pm

Thanks for that mate, ive just been using fuchs gt2050 at the moment but the next oil change I will use the BP stuff and see how it goes.

RoddQLD
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Re:Oil Additives

Unread post by RoddQLD » October 10th, 2005, 3:11 pm

I got some of that Moreys stuff from my favourite parts supplier here. He said that other people had used it and were very happy with it.
I've noticed that it has virtually stopped the leak from my rear engine seal, and any blue smoke when I 'take off' from a standstill. It was $16 for a 2 litre bottle (?).

dru
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fuel and oil additives

Unread post by dru » September 21st, 2010, 5:55 pm

I have been looking at the adds in the the lact 3 or 4 mags and came across the add for "CEM" cost effective mantinance now they claim some big things and for the price you pay for the items you would expect it to work as it sayes,
now there is a fuel add and a oil flushing add,

has any one out there used this stuff and what did you think of it?
is it worth the money?
should i buy some?
what to do. what to do, any help would be good thanks
dru

dhc4ever
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Re: fuel and oil additives

Unread post by dhc4ever » September 21st, 2010, 6:25 pm

I use the oil flushing concentrate.
I used it when I first got my diesel cruiser and use the maintenance dose when I change the oil, it does seem to keep the oil cleaner a bit longer before it starts turning black.
You get a more dramatic effect if the vehicle you're using it on has been neglected, ie oil change intervals not followed, it seems to move a lot of sludge. Not so noticeable if the vehicle has been well maintained.
I haven't used the fuel additive.

Nullack
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Re: fuel and oil additives

Unread post by Nullack » September 21st, 2010, 7:17 pm

Im about to do a compression test after doing the CEM products.

I try to understand what the machinery is doing and how these sorts of products could help or not.

I dont think much of oil additives. Theres additives in oil anyway, they buy base stock then blend it.

With fuel additives - yep, theres proof it can work.

Im particular to note that my diesel is an indirect combustion diesel so I expect results from my CEM treatment. On a new direct engine diesel with the piezo electric injectors I dont think its reasonable to expect the same results.

I'm "feeling" more compression and freerer revving but I dont want to share any conclusions until Ive compression tested the engine again. Im hoping the rings got all cleaned up and the compression is better now across all pots in the block.

bloke76
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Re: fuel and oil additives

Unread post by bloke76 » September 21st, 2010, 8:05 pm

i used the CEM flushing oil concentrate on my deisel hilux, 2000 model 3.0litre.

it definately cleanes some crap out of your oil galleries, i filled my engine with 6 litres of oil, added the required amount of concentrete, which was 72ml for me.
i ran the engine at 1250 rpm for 30 min as per instructions and then drained out 8 litres... so it dissolved 2 litres of crap build-up from my oil galleries..
You only add a few ml before draining after initial major flush so i should be able to treat about 8 oil changes so 40,000km worth.

i bought the pack with the fuel additive and i add it when i fill up aswell. it is mixed at 1:4000 which is enough for nearly 10,000km for me out of 250ml bottle

economy got slightly better, about 20-30km extra per tank and engine definately revs more freely after the oil flush.

from my experiences it is worth a try and quite cost effective as the same says..

whizzo
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Re: fuel and oil additives

Unread post by whizzo » September 21st, 2010, 10:57 pm

Um... probably did not disolve 2 litres of crap.....the oil probably expended or frothed a bit.

But but there is no disputing uggly black bluuurrrk in the drain pan. :eek:

cheers

bloke76
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Re: fuel and oil additives

Unread post by bloke76 » September 22nd, 2010, 7:51 pm

ha ha ha ha.. you reckon my oil expanded whizzo.... yeah i have oil that expands from 6 to 8 litres when you add a solvent to it :rolleyes: what did you base that theory on ??

no froth came out with the oil...and it sat in the drain tub overnight and it didn't shrink back to 6 litres when cool.

have you used or researched the oil flushing concentrates ??
Last edited by bloke76 on September 22nd, 2010, 8:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Pog
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Re: fuel and oil additives

Unread post by Pog » September 22nd, 2010, 8:16 pm

Expanded after applying heat I assume he meant.

Expansion/contraction of matter when heated/cooled is a well described physical principle.

bloke76
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Re: fuel and oil additives

Unread post by bloke76 » September 22nd, 2010, 8:22 pm

yes i know matter expands/contracts when heated/cooled but oil doesn't expand by 35% in an engine

whizzo
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Re: fuel and oil additives

Unread post by whizzo » September 23rd, 2010, 11:26 am

You have added a substance that is not oil to your engine, a substance similar to a deterget or such.
It is far more reasonable to expect that some sort of chemical reaction resulting in an increase in the volume of oil ( and other substances) has occured than an extra 2 litres (30% of original volume) of matter has magicaly come from .....where????.

There are many simple chemical reactions that can be observed where liquids increase in volume particularly in the presence of heat and do not return to their original volume.

The majority of the sludge existing in the motor would have been in the bottom of the sump, which would have displaced existing oil volume.

Sure there may be "some" other matter on the inside surfaces of your engine but not a large amount in volume.

Remember too your filter will hold arround a liter in these diesels.

So...unless you have, measured the amount of oil insrteted into the engine, accounted for filling of the filter or not, related that to a level on the dip stick.
AND THEN
after draining and refilling, filled the engine to the same level on the dipstic and recorded a now increased engine oil capacity of 2 litres.

You did not remove 2 litres of sludge.

If you are going to mobilise sludge and or varnish in your motor ( or for that matter any heavy viscous matter in a lighter one in any situation) that matter must necessarily be disolved or diluted, this process may very likely increase that matter in volume, particularly if detergenst or similar are invilved.

Considering the specified capacity of a 5L hilux diesel is listed as
6 litres with out filter and 6.9 litres with filter.....we start getting a picture of what is going on.
Being the owner of a similar vehicle, I can say if the engine is fully drained and the filter is changed you will have to add more like 7 to 7.5 litres to get the dipstick to read "full".

I am always scheptical about such claims, in particular huge amounts proportionaly of sludge comming out of engines.

It is reasonable to expect 1/2 a litre ( may be a little more of actual sludge and other rubbish existing in your engine... but 2 litres is just unrealistic and unreasonable.

Unless in the oil change before you only added 4 to 5 litres to fill the engine to the full mark on the dipstick including replacing the filter and properly draining the engine.

If you had 2 litres of sludge in your sump, you would likely have to poke a hole thru it to let the oil drain out thru the sunp plug...

Another posibilty is that some of the oil galeries were inhibited in draining prior to the flush.
Last oil change I dry cranked the engine a couple of revs and got quite a bit more oil to drain out.


I have no doubt this product removed a heap of filth from your engine, and this is probaly a good thing...... but 2 litres from a 7 litre capacity come on.

cheers

bloke76
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Re: fuel and oil additives

Unread post by bloke76 » September 23rd, 2010, 12:13 pm

ok, you have some valid point but how about you try it and see what happens.

this is the process i followed...

- ran my engine as usual to heat the oil.
- drained the oil (i did not remove the filter)
- i poured 6 litres of fresh oil to the motor
- added the flush concentrate
- ran the engine for 30 min as per instructions
- pulled the drain plug and 8 litres of oil drained out (i did not remove the filter until i was ready to refill with new oil)

so the oil filter capacity and they way i measured are irrelevant.. i added 6 litres, ran the flush and drained out 8 litres... simple as that.

i read many testimonials and was sceptical about the ones saying they drained extra dissolved oil residue/gunk from oil galleries until i did it myself.

i really don't think it is feasable that a detergent would make it increase in volume by 35%

read some of the testimonials and try it for yourself... many clients and the manufactures say it is common for 2-3 litres of sludge/residue to be broken down and drained..

http://www.costeffective.com.au/case_st ... p#Flushing

it is not just sump sludge, it will clean grime from all the surfaces from all the oil galleries throughout the motor which is where i think a lot ofit comes from... a thin film over quite a large surface area.

until you have some experince with a product you are not really in a position to comment on the topic as you have nothing to base your "sceptical" criticism on.

I use it, it cleaned 2 litres of sludge/goo/residue from my motor and I recommend it...

good luck

wilyum
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Re: fuel and oil additives

Unread post by wilyum » October 1st, 2010, 8:08 pm

bluehilux wrote:i can vouch for the ftc decarboniser fuel additive..( it was used in conjuction with chemtech diesel power ) tested on my hilux before the motor and pump was rebuilt and dads 92 rodeo.. added the amount in a full tank of fuel with both cars and both used 1 liter less fuel per 100km's
the oil flush worked on dads car, its direct injection turbo and the oil doesn't go black.. flushed as per instruction and got about 750 mill more out and it was quite dirty..
also ive added to antiwear in front diff, transfer, gearbox.
I can vouch for the effectiveness of CEM`s FOC also.I have used their products for about 10 years now,They work for me.Isn`t it funny that those who knock the product are generally those who haven`t used it. By the way it is not a solvent it is a detergent.
Cheers,
Wilyum.

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