Wooders Heep - new projects

[wooders]

Ok just to bring you upto date.
Started with a Standard TJ:
http://www.aussiejeepimages.com/gallery2/d/21299-2/Deadstock1.JPG

Then made a few mods to get:
http://www.offroadimages.com.au/OE/Events/TT05/04/images/TT05_04_060.jpg

Now we have some BIG mods coming shortly - but rather than spill my guts - you're just gonna have to check back :-*

[Texas]

Nice one, just a few basic mods :D By the way, good effort at tuff truck.

[wooders]

Hmmm it's gotta fit somehow
http://i20.ebayimg.com/03/i/03/f2/da/dd_1_b.JPG

[Gojeep]

What is hell is that from??
I have never seen such a long pinion going to be used on such a short wheelbase as yours. You just need a double cardon joint at the end and it will bolt up to the transfercase too. ;)

[wooders]

Next clue ;D
http://i9.ebayimg.com/03/i/03/f1/8e/4a_1_b.JPG

[4xgold0]

just got issue 80 and seen your 4b in there, very very impressive

[gooch4]

is that 4 wheel steering we are looking at there???

[Searsy]

Are they mogs? They look pretty cool.

[Gojeep]

They are definitely portals ;D
Not Volvo ones though.
http://www.itsajeep.org/PhotoPost/data/15062/medium/35Image101.jpg
http://www.itsajeep.org/PhotoPost/showgallery.php?cat=500&ppuser=35
They are some beefy joints there 8)
But do look like Unimog ones ;)
http://www.killeraxles.com/assets/images/Axle_Parts_036.xxl.jpg
http://www.killeraxles.com/assets/images/dsc00203.jpg
http://www.killeraxles.com/html/portal_axles.html

[Humpy]

You really didnt like being one of the little guys at tuff truck did you ;D

Im assuming you will go for a longer wheelbase and bigger rubber 8)

Are you keeping the fart bags and will it still be road worthy?

[crankycruiser]

Very kewl Heep Wooders....

I like ;D

[wooders]

LOL Dang it I gave too much away :-X

Yes twas humbling being sandwiched between 49" & 46 " tyres......but that's not the main reason we're doing this project - bacisally I want clearance & i want strength & this seems the best way to gain gobs of both ;)
Yes I plan to extend the wheel base a bit (I'll need to),
No I do not plan to narrow the diffs 8),
Yes I plan to keep the fart bags (like 'em too much),
Yes we are aiming for full street rego etc
rear steer - undecided I will have most of the bits - but road legailities are bloody difficult then....so i dunno yet...

[patrol]

LOL Dang it I gave too much away :-X

Yes twas humbling being sandwiched between 49" & 46 " tyres......but that's not the main reason we're doing this project - bacisally I want clearance & i want strength & this seems the best way to gain gobs of both ;)
Yes I plan to extend the wheel base a bit (I'll need to),
No I do not plan to narrow the diffs 8),
Yes I plan to keep the fart bags (like 'em too much),
Yes we are aiming for full street rego etc
rear steer - undecided I will have most of the bits - but road legailities are bloody difficult then....so i dunno yet...


Are you planning on it being engineered or just keep it registered and get a pink slip on the sly? because with the new laws regarding modified vehicles that are coming out next month I don't like your chances of keeping it road legal, you will have to loose the drum brakes for a start, I looked into this a couple of years ago, the engineer laughed he said with diffs that size it's like the tail wagging the dog, it can be done but FARK it's big money to do it properly, the pinion conversions and disc brakes are the least of the problems.

[wooders]

Are you planning on it being engineered or just keep it registered and get a pink slip on the sly? because with the new laws regarding modified vehicles that are coming out next month I don't like your chances of keeping it road legal, you will have to loose the drum brakes for a start, I looked into this a couple of years ago, the engineer laughed he said with diffs that size it's like the tail wagging the dog, it can be done but FARK it's big money to do it properly, the pinion conversions and disc brakes are the least of the problems.


No I specifically want it fully engineered and fully road legal....otherwise Id just build a buggy ;)
As for the "new laws" lots of romours floating about and not much actual detail, and I believe that we should be within the proposed guidlines anyhow - for example I plan to only run about 2" of lift.
As for the Drums - Why do you say I would have to lose those? Discs would actually be more of a pain because the I would be altering the track.

[Gojeep]

Had friends of mine fit the Volvo portals under a 110 Landy and got it fully certified with the drums all round. He just had to do the braking tests etc with a G force meter on board to prove the right level of retardation.

[wooders]

Yup I'm expecting braking tests and swerve tests - but I;m not really expecting any major dramas - if mogdiffs can pull up a pully laden 5orso Ton truck (often with trailer) - my little TJ will barely register ;)

[crankycruiser]

Yup I'm expecting braking tests and swerve tests - but I;m not really expecting any major dramas - if mogdiffs can pull up a pully laden 5orso Ton truck (often with trailer) - my little TJ will barely register ;)



I reckon u are right about that... those brakes will hardly know ur Jeep is sittin on em :)

[patrol]

Yup I'm expecting braking tests and swerve tests - but I;m not really expecting any major dramas - if mogdiffs can pull up a pully laden 5orso Ton truck (often with trailer) - my little TJ will barely register ;)



Have you talked to an engineer? It's not always what would seem reasonable that will pass, some engineers would argue that putting drum brakes that were designed 50 years ago under a jeep with disc brakes is not a good idea, I'm sure the drums will be good enough but the engineers I talked too didn't want to know about it.
Your not expecting any major dramas putting mog diffs under a wrangler :o

[simonsurf]

All I can say Wooders is good luck, I'm jealous and mmmmmmmm, portal hubs (drool drool drool :P)

[wooders]

Have you talked to an engineer? It's not always what would seem reasonable that will pass, some engineers would argue that putting drum brakes that were designed 50 years ago under a jeep with disc brakes is not a good idea, I'm sure the drums will be good enough but the engineers I talked too didn't want to know about it.
Your not expecting any major dramas putting mog diffs under a wrangler :o


Sure have been busy talking to the engineer - was the first thing I did before committing to these things ;)
And yes you are right whiolst on the surface a "normal person" might think yeah it's ok, an engineer can often highlight several reason why it's not and often why it's not safe etc.
But in this case the engineer was ok - mostly becuase generally drums are MORE braking efficient than discs - just more prone to fad when heated and not as good through mud/water (generally not a road going concern). Since these drums are sized to pull MUCh larger loads to a halt - it's highly unlikely that I will over heat them unless I ride the suckers.
However yes I will need to look at the bakeing system to ensure it's aptly sized and proportioned to give proper and safe braking.

I will confess the engineer wasn't so thrilled at the idea of hydro-rear-steer :-X. But at this stage whilst we'll have most of the required parts we're not going that way specifically because I want the vehicle to be completely streetable.

As for fitting them under the TJ - LOL yes it WILL be a challenge - but if it weren't every man & his dog would have by now ;)
I will have to convert the Torque tube to a pinion yoke.
I think I will need to lift the motor and the fuel tankfor more clearance.
More wheel base will be a neseccity - I'm aiming for about 10" extra wheelbase (ie about 104").
Steering will be a challenge - but with the steering knuckle located behind the diff I'm hoping to be able to push the diff itself forward a bit.
Suspension linages - I'm hoping to retain (but relocate) most of my current linkages - although I'll confess I'm toying with the idea of converting the rear to a watts link ;)

So will it be easy - nah not really....but at the end of the day I believe it's physically possible - infact I know of ONE other bloke in the US that has fitted a set of narrowed mogs - but IMHO narrowing it sorta defeats one of the benefits of full width :-*

Oh yeah and I plan to swap out the transmission for an auto and some transfer case modifications to shorten it further....stay turned..... ;D

[Twisty]

All this sounds awesome wooders!!! Can't wait to see the progress pics... :D

When does it all get underway?

[wooders]

Diffs are on the slow boat from USA - via China I think :P
Hopefully the knife will be yielded in about late June.

awesome job wooders!

cant wait to see the finished product 8)

and portels under a tj would this be a first ?

[patrol]

Have you talked to an engineer? It's not always what would seem reasonable that will pass, some engineers would argue that putting drum brakes that were designed 50 years ago under a jeep with disc brakes is not a good idea, I'm sure the drums will be good enough but the engineers I talked too didn't want to know about it.
Your not expecting any major dramas putting mog diffs under a wrangler :o


Sure have been busy talking to the engineer - was the first thing I did before committing to these things ;)
And yes you are right whiolst on the surface a "normal person" might think yeah it's ok, an engineer can often highlight several reason why it's not and often why it's not safe etc.
But in this case the engineer was ok - mostly becuase generally drums are MORE braking efficient than discs - just more prone to fad when heated and not as good through mud/water (generally not a road going concern). Since these drums are sized to pull MUCh larger loads to a halt - it's highly unlikely that I will over heat them unless I ride the suckers.
However yes I will need to look at the bakeing system to ensure it's aptly sized and proportioned to give proper and safe braking.

I will confess the engineer wasn't so thrilled at the idea of hydro-rear-steer :-X. But at this stage whilst we'll have most of the required parts we're not going that way specifically because I want the vehicle to be completely streetable.

As for fitting them under the TJ - LOL yes it WILL be a challenge - but if it weren't every man & his dog would have by now ;)
I will have to convert the Torque tube to a pinion yoke.
I think I will need to lift the motor and the fuel tankfor more clearance.
More wheel base will be a neseccity - I'm aiming for about 10" extra wheelbase (ie about 104").
Steering will be a challenge - but with the steering knuckle located behind the diff I'm hoping to be able to push the diff itself forward a bit.
Suspension linages - I'm hoping to retain (but relocate) most of my current linkages - although I'll confess I'm toying with the idea of converting the rear to a watts link ;)

So will it be easy - nah not really....but at the end of the day I believe it's physically possible - infact I know of ONE other bloke in the US that has fitted a set of narrowed mogs - but IMHO narrowing it sorta defeats one of the benefits of full width :-*

Oh yeah and I plan to swap out the transmission for an auto and some transfer case modifications to shorten it further....stay turned..... ;D



It sounds like you have done your homework, I hope it all works out I'd like to see a road legal 4wd with mog diffs, the only advice I have is make sure you get as many of the mods as possible engineered before you put the diffs under it, the less they have to pass when they engineer those diffs the better. Are you doing the work yourself?

[Humpy]

patrol, I think if you had a look at Wooders Website (http://www.wooders.com.au/) some of your concerns would be answered.

BTW the Mogrover has Mog axles and is engineered in queensland

8)

[wooders]

LOL thanks for the plug ;)
Or you could look at my personal site - www.geocities.com/wooders_tj/ ;) (although it's been a long time since I updated it :-X)

Yes I plan to do most of the work myself - that to me is part of the hobby & fun factor....
Although It seems I might have to finish my CJ6 project first so I have room in the garage to work on the danged thing :P

[GUHOON]

Good luck wooders- should be a total weapon when its done (even though i thought it was already ;))

[wooders]

awesome job wooders!

cant wait to see the finished product 8)

and portels under a tj would this be a first ?


Yeah I'm hanging to see it finished myself (or even properly started :-X)...
Not the first time it's benn done. A few (about 5) have done it in the US - but most are dedicated comp trucks....

[wooders]

Whatca think of these sort of tyres - These as just the right size for the diffs & rims I plan.....395/85R20 ;D
http://i10.ebayimg.com/03/i/04/19/a2/22_1_b.JPG
Edit - but currently $100usd/tyre - sounds ok ;)

[Gojeep]

They look like some sort of truck tyre aren't they? If they are, they wont work at all well with your light weight of a TJ on top. No flex in the sidewalls with 0 psi I recond! They work out at 46.43" tall but would have to be made to suit your vehicle mass. Are they?

[BLU-125]

$100usd a tire.........we should buy a 40 footer full ;D ;D ;D

Hang on thats not many tires though.......

[wooders]

They look like some sort of truck tyre aren't they? If they are, they wont work at all well with your light weight of a TJ on top. No flex in the sidewalls with 0 psi I recond! They work out at 46.43" tall but would have to be made to suit your vehicle mass. Are they?

Yeah they are a Truck tyre.
Yup my little TJ would struggle to get those to bag out.
Seriously - nah I'm looking at somewhere in the 38-42" range......But dang would be fun to try these out :-*


$100usd a tire.........we should buy a 40 footer full ;D ;D ;D
Hang on thats not many tires though.......


LOL but by air it would cost $1000/tyre ;)

[Gojeep]

Funny thing is I think I have seen them a few times, and they were all fitted to Unimogs too. ;)

we need an up date? ;D ;D ;D

[wooders]

Not much to tell - new diffs are on the boat and aren't due to land here till the 5th August :-X :-[

[turboplandcruiser]

Hey wooders, i noe you want a set of tires for that beast when you finish it and i cum accross sumtin, i dnt noe if you have heard of them they MAXXIS M8060 Trepador, they look like an extreme tyre.
check out
http://www.maxxis.com/products/automotive/product_detail.asp?id=329

[wooders]

Quick update.
picked up my new axles today!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[wooders]

Arrived Friday ;D
http://www.aussiejeepimages.com/gallery2/d/31289-1/100_0599_sm.jpg

[Humpy]

So which is heavier, the axles or the rest of the truck ??? ;D

What's the other tube in that photo?

[wooders]

HMMM the TJ in Standard trim weights about 1500kg.....
The mog axles weigh in at 700kg.....
So by the time you remove the standard axles (maybe 250kg)....they are certainly a fair proportion of the overal weight ;)
BUT think of how low my COG will be ;D....and combine that with full width stability ;D.......

That other tube is the Torque Tube - effectively the UniMog driveshaft (inside the tube).....we'll be using this to fabricate the pinion conversion ;)

[Humpy]

Cool

Now that you have the bits, when is the maiden drive, and will it be at woodpecker? 8)

how long do ya recon, i really cant wait till its finished

[wooders]

LOL impatient lot ain't ya ;)

The basic plan right now is - J20 V8 transplant (other thread) must be completed before 20th September for the Jeep "Classic Not Plastic" event.
Then I start work on the TJ, which is booked into Nissan trials in November.....
So I guess not much sleep over then next few months.....And means I'd better get off the net, my butt back home & into some real work ;)

[Humpy]

Pics Wooders ???

[wooders]

You find the bloody charger to my digi-cam & I'll get pics......Sorry the wife put it "somewhere safe" & stuffed if we can find it and I actually NEED the danged thing :-X

Anyhow soon - have new charger on order...... 8)

[Humpy]

If it wasnt for the boss loosing 3 of the companies digital cameras and the charger for the other one, I wouldnt believe you :P

Hopefully you get the charger for christmas

[Reddo]

IMO i think the watts is the way to go ;D old man has been telling me about it for ages...hehe

I know there's a few ppl watching this one Wooder's, myself included. How much did they cost from the US? PM me if ya like.

[Reddo]

Also, what are you going to do for rims?

[Slunnie]

Why a watts linkage rather than an A-frame etc? The watts linkage can limit your travel, especially if you're running 14" shocks. Factory Rover ones at least will limit you to 10" max, and although you can improve on this, can you improve enough?

BTW, also keenly watching the build Wooders! Top Job. And how in hell did you lift Mogs off the truck :o I cant hardly move LC60. :-[

[Oz4x4]

What happened to this project, is it still happening? I'd like to see mog diffs under a registered wrangler.

[wooders]

I've got the diffs - still chasing extra parts, rims & tyres.
Plus we decided not to immediately start so that we could still go to tufftruck this year.
Also waiting on the 3speed transfer case......
Oh yeah still planning the wheel base stretch (looking at Unlimted length). And that means more parts on the shopping list.
Sp in summary it's still progressing just slowly and carefully - especially since it's still being done to a budget and still want it streetable at the end.
Lastly just have a few too many other projects on the plate right now all progressing abet slowly :-X

[Twisty]

Any updates yet Wooders.....am keen to see this buildup get under way!! 8)

[wooders]

Not that much to report.

Orded new triangulated suspension arms - which will be adapted to suit.....ALLOY arms at that ;)

Decided that I AM going to convert to disc brakes - an now busy looking at the designs....Hope to fab one up myself - most of the kits are WAY expensive.....

Now pic the mog axle shaft fromt the stock Jeep shaft ;)
http://www.aussiejeepimages.com/gallery2/d/65223-2/Splines-side.JPG

[Humpy]

Not that much to report.

Orded new triangulated suspension arms - which will be adapted to suit.....ALLOY arms at that ;)

Decided that I AM going to convert to disc brakes - an now busy looking at the designs....Hope to fab one up myself - most of the kits are WAY expensive.....

Now pic the mog axle shaft fromt the stock Jeep shaft ;)
http://www.aussiejeepimages.com/gallery2/d/65223-2/Splines-side.JPG


The alloy arms are to make up for the increase in axle weight are they ???

:P

[bad_religion_au]

the words budget, mogs, and 3 speed transfer case don't belong in the same sentance :D

[wooders]

The alloy arms are to make up for the increase in axle weight are they ???
:P


LOL well I guess I could say that - but that's not why.
The reason if the arms are designed to flex if they take a hit.......Unlike my current arms which I've bent :(

The only concern I have right now is the effect of flexing alloy arms trying to locate the massive axle wrap of the portals.......

But I'm also looking t another setup which has bend (high clearance) arms, and uses a double triangulation to better relocate the arear axle without the panhard.....

The coin is still turning in the air......