1 HZ oil system question

[LAME2]

G'day, I have a question on the 1HZ oil system. My oil pressure light takes about 5-7 seconds to go out for the first start of the day. On other threads some poeple have said they change their oil filters before starting the engine, to save the perverbial mess, indicating it is normal for the filter to slowly drain back to the sump on the 1HZ.

Below the filter is an oil cooler pressure relief valve and a "check valve". Is the function of this check valve to stop drain back to the sump or is it normal for the filter to slowly drain to the sump. The wear during start up must be enormous compared to normal running. Other vehicles I've had keep oil in the filter and the pressure is instantly available (the oil filters are not upside down either!).

If the function of the check valve is to stop the drain back, perhaps mine isn't working the best it could.

Any advice is appreciated as I do not have a drawing of the oil system in any of my manuals.

[LAME2]

Can anyone help with this check valve? According to the Ellery's manual (and Gregorys), the check valve is unscrewed towards the firewall. It is located under the lip of the oil filter mount. The oil cooler pressure relief is unscrewed towards the LHS fender.

Does anyone know what flow the chjeck valve is stopping?

Any ideas?

Many thanks

[sexylux]

before pulling stuff apart, just a quick question, what brand oil filter are you using and what viscosity oil?

[Moto Mech]

Good oil filters will have an anti drain back valve in them, trapping oil inside the oil filter.On my Cruiser, the oil pressure light goes of within 1-2 seconds.I use Ryco oil filters and Delo 400 oil.

[gmax]

mate, 5 to 7 secs is a long time for a normal startup to get oil pressure...
and not normal.
oil viscosity and or cold climate will also effect the time it takes...
do also consider a worn oil lube pump, it may make ok pressure when primed and running, but slow to pickup due to some extra clearances...
(especially if it has ever been starved in the past...??)

the spring loaded item in some filters(as mentioned above) is normally a "bypass" ie - if the filter chokes up... it will bypass and let unfiltered oil onwards into the galleries etc, sounds crazy but the logic is better to have some dirty oil than none at all ( think about it...)

my 1HZ would not drain back the oil from the filter, so something sounds amiss for that to be your case. the manual does show a check valve to the rear of the filter - that is the likely culprit.
the other one (on the side) is a relief valve for hi (excessive)pressure when cold etc and the oil is thicker

cheers

[LAME2]

before pulling stuff apart, just a quick question, what brand oil filter are you using and what viscosity oil?

Thanks all for the help. Been away from the computer for a while. The oil is Castrol Super Diesel 15W-40. The oil filter I have changed and the current one specfies the anti drainback valve (internal rubber/silicon dam over the outside holes of the filter). I can be sure having changed the filter as I have, it cannot be the filters internal anti drainback valve. So I assume the oil is draining back through the outlet of the filter, (the large center hole). This brought my curiosity to the check valve and whether anyone could say which oil flow it checks.

Looking at the Ellerys manual I should be able to pull the check valve out without too much hassle and maybe it has some junk under the seat.

I'll report back with the findings and more questions if I need help.

Many thanks

[dieselpower]

I'm interested to see how this goes for you, as mine also takes 5-7 seconds. If it fixes it for you I'll have a look on mine too to see if it helps.

[LAME2]

No joy on the check valve. The diameter of the inlet bore of the check valve is about 150 thou. Not large enough for the full flow of the filter. Pulled the filter off for access and it was empty (car has been sitting for a week whilst I was away). I fed into the spigot that sits inside the filter when the filter is fitted, a flexible plastic tube. It went in for about 8 inches towards the engine centre line. I shone a torch down this spigot and could not see any light through the check valve hole and visa versa. I cleaned the valve and blew as hard as I could into it and I don't think it leaked.

I now don't think the check valve is for the filter, perhaps the oil cooler uses it.

Without a flow diagram of the oil system I guess I'm a bit lost. I'll try talking to the local Toyota guys this week. They may feel some pity and show me a diagram.

As I previously have said, on a previous post regarding how to stop oil running all over the engine during engine changes, a fourm member said he did the filter change before starting the engine, as his filter was drained overnight. Maybe I don't have a problem, it just seems odd to have the engine run whilst the filter is filled at the start of each day. Bette to have it filled once and reduce wear on each daily start.

Anyone else got any ideas?

[dhc4ever]

LAME2
I have just bought an 80 series with 1HZ and the first thing I noticed was it was takeing 7 secs for the oil light to go out.
Changed the oil and the brand of filter ( now using Ryco) the light now go out in 2 secs.
If left for 3 or so days that seems to stretch out to around 4 secs as I assume the filter slowly drains into the engine over that time.
Cheapest test is to change the filter, the drain back valve in the one you have fitted may be faulty, which brand of filter are you useing?.

[LAME2]

Currently with a RYCO Z334 filter. Needs an oil change in about 500Km so was thinking of getting a Toyota filter and trying that. Earlier filter not RYCO but tossed it so cannot tell exactly what brand it was. With the help of others on the forum have found the oil system diagram. The small "check valve" to me is a bypass valve in case of high pressures, which explains the small bore of the valve itself. I have attempted to paste the diagram on this forum. Hope it works! Solid lines are pipes, dotted are gravity return.

I'm thinking the filter will drain through the filter outlet if there are clearances in the recieving equipment large enough to allow it to happen.

[notowjoe]

Hi lame2, just for your info i use castrol rx super 15-40w diesel engine oil and was using a Z334 RYCO filter and also had 6sec before the light would switch off. I now have a fleetguard LF3608 fitted but it still takes 6sec to switch off. Like you my next filter will be a toyota filter and ill see what happens then but ive still got 1500km to go till the next change and ill keep an eye out for your results.

[HZJ75_John]

I think a 1HZ workshop manual from toyota is about $40-$50 which has an oil flow schematic diagram in it.

[LAME2]

Thanks Guys, I have sourced a manual and currently have found my filter will empty in approximatly 5 minutes. I set a rig up with a plastic hose pushed tightly onto the filter outlet spigot.

I filled the hose with oil and when the air was gone from the system I measured the time it took for the oil level to drop, under gravity not pressure.

From the dipstick bracket it took 90 seconds for the level to fall to what would be the top of the filter. It took another 5 minutes for the level to drop to the top of the spigot (filter empty).

I am currently pulling the sump off to see where the oil is flowing from. It might take a while. Three hours and the sump is still firmly attached by sealant!

[Moto Mech]

Thanks Guys, I have sourced a manual and currently have found my filter will empty in approximatly 5 minutes. I set a rig up with a plastic hose pushed tightly onto the filter outlet spigot.

I filled the hose with oil and when the air was gone from the system I measured the time it took for the oil level to drop, under gravity not pressure.

From the dipstick bracket it took 90 seconds for the level to fall to what would be the top of the filter. It took another 5 minutes for the level to drop to the top of the spigot (filter empty).

I am currently pulling the sump off to see where the oil is flowing from. It might take a while. Three hours and the sump is still firmly attached by sealant!

Just wait till you have to clean the sealant off the sump, takes ages.Sticks and sets like cement.Make sure you use a speciality sealant when you put it back on.I always use a sealant from Toyota, costs about $12.Any sealant will not do.

[LAME2]

Just an update. The car has been back on the road for three days and the problem appears to be fixed. The test rig I set up originally took 5 minutes to go from what would have been the top of the filter to when the oil level disappeared down the filter outlet spigot. It now takes 10 minutes. See photo below.

I took the sump off. Took me 6 and a half hours to break the seal and get the mongrel off. The big ends had the maximum allowable side slop. I replaced all of them.

I also have fitted a toyota filter, not that I really can see any difference between it and a RYCO visually.

The light now takes 2-3 seconds to go out, even after the car has sat stationary (engine off) for 18 hours.

I think the problem was in the big ends. The motor runs so quiet now all the gearbox noises are audiable! I no longer have the tick at 95 km/hr also.

Condem me all. After such a hard time getting the sump off, I replaced the goop with a gasket seal. I bought some gasket paper and carefully cut out a seal. Fitted it ensuring clearances. Put a small amount of goop on the block to hold it in place and tightened down the sump. The next day I removed all the bolts and applied some locktite and tightened the bolts down again. It may weep, but I'm hoping it wil not be a huge problem and if I ever need to go back in there again, it will take 30 minutes!

Many thanks to all who helped and offered advise.

Merry Christmas

Lame no more!